Larry in Seattle writes:
I have been very vocal in not allowing myself into a backscatter machine, but was tricked into it two days ago against my will.
I was getting on a flight for Seattle from Amsterdam after having to go to Berlin on business (I work at Microsoft). I walked up to security and someone pulled my passport and walked off telling me to stand in an arbitrary spot.
He then said to go stand in a cattle stall. I never travel to Europe so I assumed that was a holding area for some customs reason. A lady came over and said “Hold your arms up like in the picture”, I was kinda like “huh?” and looked in front of me and saw a stick figure drawing of a person with their arms over their head. I said “I don’t want to go in a backscatter machine, this isn’t a backscatter machine is it?” She said “No”, and I half heartedly lifted my arms up and said “what kind of a machine is this?” and a bar zoomed around me. The door opened and she pulled me out. I could then see a screen with a masked image of myself on it and knew they had put me into a backscatter machine against my will.
There was no way around these machines, there was no passthru or way to opt out. Only a funnel leading to two machines side by side. I looked from the other side and saw what looked to be a “normal” metal detector to the side but it was roped off with crime-scene like tape so you couldn’t get into it.
I’m furious about this.
It might have been a millimetre wave machine but what happened to informed consent?
25 Responses to Larry in Seattle: I was tricked into the scanner
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its getting like a futuristic scifi film. but not fiction not the future…. its now … and its wrong.
I’m pretty sure the machines at SeaTac are in fact back scatter not millimeter wave.
From TFA: “I was getting on a flight *for* Seattle *from* Amsterdam after having to go to Berlin on business…” [emphasis mine]. In other words, this didn’t happen in Seattle; it happened in Amsterdam.
TheWall recently posted..Disconnect
I am very deeply concerned that this is the future of all travel. We must find ways to protect ourselves and the future of freedom in general.
Being that he was in Amsterdam I’m not sure why he’d expect to have the right to opt out over there. Europe is not America, particularly when it comes to personal privacy.
Good point. I’m not sure what the options are over there. But I’m pretty sure they use millimeter wave in Amsterdam.
In a way, good for Amsterdam. I mean, here in the US we have hypocrisy: the TSA says the scanners are safe and their privacy safeguards are sufficient and that the use of the scanners is necessary. But then they give us the option of declining them. Why? For safety? TSA says they’re safe. For privacy? TSA says they have adequate safeguards. Either believe in your position and make the scanners mandatory, or acknowledge there are legitimate safety and privacy concerns and actually reconsider their deployment.
And then they use enhanced pat-downs as a passive-aggressive way of forcing people through the scanners. Frankly, if that’s their policy I wish they’d just man up and say everyone has to go through the scanners, which is what they want anyway, because then they can’t make excuses about the invasiveness of the scanners. In fact it’s worse this way, it’s like they want to humiliate those who are skeptical of the scanners, and they can afford not to scan them because the scanning isn’t that important anyway.
So at least the security people over there have chosen a firm position and will have to defend it. And at least they do have the “stick figure” privacy feature, which is better than what we have.
I think what stinks here for Larry is that he wasn’t aware of this policy before he flew.
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I hurt my shoulder. I can’t raise my left arm or it’s extremely painful. Would you lift it up for me? No? OK, I’ll try it. A I I I I E E E E E ! ! !
How about, “small doses of radiation make me vomit. Have you got a trash can handy? It’s really embarrassing to barf on the floor. Couldn’t you just handle my balls, instead?”
“No way, man! I saw on FOX News those things make you sterile.”
Do you know if they are using these only for folks on flights to the US or for all flights out of Amsterdam?
Ok, as a German, I think I want to comment on the “privacy” issues in Europe. First of all, let me say I’m furious about the new TSA changes. With that said, Europeans enjoy their privacy quite a bit, thank you very much. After having grown up in Germany, and lived in Austria, England and Greece for extended periods of time, and now having lived in the US for 8 years, I have felt a greater loss of freedom here in the US than I ever have in Europe. Keep in mind that in Europe it’s currently only the Netherlands and the UK that have the scanners. The Netherland has a modified version (where the displayed image of your body is altered, so it doesn’t look like you anymore…), and the rest of Europe while initially considering the scanners, has backed away from them, wanting to do more research, and because people aren’t too keen on them. There actually have been naked protests at the airport in Frankfurt (Germany) I think, against the scanners (even though Germany doesn’t have any). Europe is definitely not as infested with sheep-mentality as the US, and I wish people here would stand up more for things, instead of just believing and obeying anything coming from Big Bro (or Big Sis in this case).
Anyway, there is a good chance that they only give you the scanner option in the Netherlands. Why offer something else, if you feel that the scanner is safe for everyone no matter what? That does make sense to me. I don’t think there is a need to pick on Europe for not valuing personal privacy though because of that – because clearly the US isn’t doing better right now. It would be like offering a different entrance to a plane for those who request it, when there is no need because the available entrance works fine for everyone. Europe is definitely not into the business of doing extra stuff for people, just because they want it -unless there is a good reason.
You are right, America is populated by sheeple. We pride ourselves in thinking we are free, but when big brother tells us to do something we Americans role over and do as we say.
I hope Europe does not go down this dark road of total government control. Fight it every step of the way.
A few lessons.
1. Never let your ID out of your possession.
2. Any one can lie to you.
3. You have NO rights anywhere.
This leads to a question of WHEN you should “opt out” — I think the best thing is to wait until the last possible second before you are sent into a machine (in case they are going to let you go through a normal metal detector instead). If you opt out too early this may identify you as a “troublemaker” unnecessarily
Patrick from MA recently posted..Brother MFC-7840W Multifunction Scanner Review
I’m hearing from the medical community that there is NO such thing as safe radiation. So backscatter or millimeter wave, it’s all radiation according to the manufacturer.
u235sentinel recently posted..February 18- 2009
Firearm shaped pieces of aluminum foil taped to your body in absurd places and angles.
AFAIK, there is no opt-out in Europe.
What are the solutions? Maybe we can talk about this, because it helps.
~It was helpful and heartening to me to read about charter planes being on the upswing since this started. That’s one way out.
~Class action lawsuits are published by the media where private suits are not, said a political strategist to me. Further they carry more impact and are less expensive.
~Move out of the country, pay your taxes elsewhere.
~Call Disneyland, your Chamber of Commerce, the airlines, tell them you are not traveling until this situation is changed back to the old, acceptable way. Ask them to get involved in stopping this nonsense.
~Tell them to shut off access to the planes via back doors used by airport personnel. Those doors should require opening/key holding only by appointed airport employees, not just by any Joe Shmoe working there and carrying beverages onto the planes. To frisk The People and treat us all like terrorists until proven innocent, but to keep these back doors to the airplanes accessible to just about anyone who works at the airport and many of them have criminal records (disclosed a US Customs Agent, Diane someone-or-other years ago, I would have to google it again)….now that is security theatre, if you ask me.
I just flew out of Pittsburgh yesterday and the BS and MW machines were taped off and marked “DO NOT ENTER”.
My daughter’s boyfriend travels about 3 weeks out of the month on business. He doesn’t want to do the machines but got talked into one the last time he flew and then had to do a custody search anyway. I told him the search was in retaliation for trying to opt out of the scan. There is no long term info on the millimeter wave machines. They are too new to have any history so the company line is that they are safe. I’m not buying that they are. The government has said too many things were safe that turned out to be very dangerous so I’m not discounting the real possibility that they are hazardous as well.
Agent Orange was safe, until it wasn’t…..
As was thalidomide. Fen-Phen. Vioxx. Ephederine. Home chemistry sets once routinely included uranium and other extremely toxic substances. Cigarettes were once touted as a means towards a healthy long life. DDT was a safe, effective and widely use pesticide, until it started killing off EVERYTHING. Lead paint. Cadmium and other heavy metals in jewelry. Mercury in dental fillings. Radiation levels that were deemed safe — theraputic, even — in the 40s and 50s are now deemed to pose an immediate and deadly threat to human life.
But our government wouldn’t lie to us about scanners used for national security. Right?
That concerns me greatly too. I had heard they were putting the machines in over there. You must remember that when in The Netherlands whatever the queen says goes. She is the absolute ruler there; it isn’t like in England. Usually the Dutch are very practical. It must have been something she ordered, and I don’t think that gives anyone any choice there. The only option would be for all foreigners to stop traveling through there. The Dutch depend earn their living being middlemen, and need the goodwill of other countries to keep their economy going. If they lose too much money from using the scanners things will change. Otherwise the queen has no reason to make any other decision.